Photo credit: Brook Halls

Singer-songwriter Marissa Nadler talked with us over the phone before her show at The Sinclair this Thursday. How she fit the interview in, we’re not sure. The 33-year-old Bostonian works as a schoolteacher during the daytime, continues work as a painter in the afternoon, and is off the perform her music live at night. Her new record July manages to dodge easy labels: dream pop, country folk, gothic singer-songwriter, black metal.  Although they’re all applicable, genres aren’t suitable for Nadler’s music. July,  just like her last 11 albums, follows minimalist songwriting as it takes on the twangs of country, sullen electronics of sodden dream pop, and the ambiance of a much darker, gloomy metal band. It’s elegant and cobweb covered, giving us the real summertime sadness we’re looking for (sorry, Lana).

We’ve got our fingers crossed she will play a cover or two at The Sinclair. Considering her answers to our interview, though, there may be too much pressure. But if she does, it’s a guaranteed treat considering she gives them the care and sincerity every cover deserves.

Allston Pudding: You just played Northside Festival. How was that?

Marissa Nadler: It was really great. We played Saint Vitus in Brooklyn—traditionally known for darker, heavier acts—and I think my music fits in there even though it isn’t that in a traditional sense. I think it sold out which is cool. It was fun. Late.

AP: What time did you go on?

MN: Almost midnight, like 11:45.

AP: Oh wow. That seems almost fitting though, right?

MN: Yeah. I think, yeah.

AP: A while ago, you used to be shy onstage and a little more reserved. What’s the biggest struggle playing live? Is it having to face the crowd if you’re someone who’s more reserved?

MN: I think I’ve come a long way. Performing live for me, well, I don’t really get nervous anymore. It took a long time to get to that point, though. I think in the past it was just self-doubt that was a hindrance. I think I’ve played enough shows at this point that I can talk myself out of the nerves if I get them. It’s not as much of an issue now though.

AP: There are several musicians who are a pleasure to see because their personality and interaction between songs is such a contrast from what they’re playing. Like your music falls under this dark folk category, but after you’re a very sweet person. Do people ever seem surprised by the difference between the two?

MN: Definitely. There are people who, if they spend a lot of time listening to a musician, they have all sorts of ideas about what they’re like. I think in the past I’ve had a lot of nervous banter [laughs]. A couple years ago, I think I talked more between songs than I do now because I realized it may be taking people out of the vibe a little. I think I watched enough YouTube clips where I was like, “Oh shit. I should probably just not talk so much.” [laughs] I think some people may expect me to be a really dark person, but I don’t think I am. I think I just put that in the music to get it out of my system.

AP: Is that because of your upbringing? In a lot of categories it goes both ways, where it’s either an outlet or a true embodiment onstage and off.

MN: I think music and art-making in general has always been a form of escapism for me. Especially when I was younger, I would create these worlds, like complete alternate universe realities full of make-believe characters. Now, even though the songwriting is pretty much 100% nonfiction, I think I’m still kind of creating this alternate world. I think that has to do with upbringing a little bit. I don’t know. I wasn’t unhappy growing up. Maybe being brought up in suburbia there’s this desire to travel to more exotic locales in your mind as a form of entertainment.

AP: So you’ve watched YouTube videos of yourself performing? That’s like–

MN: No, no, no! I have in the past. I actually try really hard not to anymore. No matter what show it is, even if it’s a big show. I generally try not to listen back to radio shows or live performances. In general, I’m trying to stay offline more except to answer emails because it’s kind of a dark hole for your psyche. Especially if you’re a female musician.

AP: Absolutely. There are a few video interviews I’ve done where people tear me up in the comment section; it’s stupid.

MN: Yeah, there’s certain websites where there comment sections are like, ugh. These days I’ve tried to avoid looking. YouTube I try not to look because it’s never going to sound like it did in real life. It’s not going to look good, you know? It’s not good for the self-esteem. And I have better things to do like write new material. [laughs]

AP: So the years you were looking were the first few years you were starting out then?

MN: Yeah, I think so. I mean, I’ve been performing for over 10 years now. The internet was still a novelty in the early years. The idea that a live performance could be on YouTube? I remember when that was kind of cool. Now it’s like a burden. I’m acutely aware that every show will be documented. It’s hard because sometimes you just want to focus on the music and not worry about what you look like, but knowing there will be photos of you online adds this extra pressure. I kind of look forward to being an old lady [laughs].

AP: If you’re offline in terms of the hyper-interaction between fans and musicians, do you still go on to find new musicians? Are there any you’ve been listening to a lot this year?

MN: Yeah. I’ve been listening to this woman Catherina Rivera. She’s actually not modern; she’s a French singer. People call her the French Nico. Let me think. I drive a lot, obviously, for touring and I have a satellite radio where I discover a lot of new music and old music. I’ve been listening to Willie’s Roadhouse a lot which is like this Willie Nelson old time country station, and I like that a lot. I switch between that and XMU, which is like the indie rock section, but I have to admit I find myself gravitating to the old songs more. I don’t know why I enjoy older music. Oh, I just discovered the comedy channels on satellite radio! That’s been a lifesaver.

AP: Which channel is it?

MN: You know, like Bill Hicks’ monologues and stuff. It’s a much more entertaining way to drive.

AP: Are there certain comedians you’ve found whose material you love?

MN: The only one that made me really laugh out loud was a Bill Hicks monologue, like an old one. He’s dead now, but he’s funny. I’ve been watching a lot of Inside Amy Schumer on TV, actually. She’s really funny. Speaking of females in the entertainment business, I think she does a really good job of making fun of that.

AP: Are there certain genres you wish people would check out more? In New England, it’s hard to find people who cling to country music as easily as they do in other parts of the country. But you draw on black metal, and that’s something where even if you say those two words most people won’t even want to try listening to that.

MN: Boston’s tough. I’m looking forward to the show and I’m hoping we get a good crowd because I don’t play here often. Truth be told, because I’ve been touring so much, I don’t go out around Boston that much. I don’t know what people are listening to. I think there is a lot of diversity in the music scene. Maybe I’m optimistic. In a way because I’m genre unspecific, it’s been challenging to find a scene in Boston to be part of, but in some ways I think that’s a good thing. I’ve been focusing on my own thing and it hasn’t been a problem elsewhere.

AP: Definitely. Boston has so much that you can pick and choose whichever scene you want to be a part of here.

MN: Yeah. I picked the bill for The Sinclair with two bands from Boston that I’m both friends with: Faces on Film and Gem Club. They’re really good, so I think it will be a good night.

AP: Do you normally pick the people that open for you or is it just because this is a home show?

MN: I try to always pick the people. I think it’s really important to try and curate the night because it sets the mood. I try to put contrasting music on bills instead of the same kind of thing. It’s important for the crowd to get some ambient drone music instead of another girl doing something really similar. I think it can get hard for the audience.

AP: Technically, what do you draw from black metal? Having an actual explanation from you could help people who don’t quite understand that genre.

MN: I’m not inspired by black metal, but I’ve been loosely affiliated with the scene because the producer I worked with has produced a couple darker records. I don’t know if you’d even call them black metal: Wolves of the Throne Room and Earth? Working with him associates me with what he’s associated with. When I went in to record my new record, all I cared about is that the songs are good. I try not to pigeonhole myself. I did sing vocals on a black metal artist’s record and I was like, “Sure, I’ll try this out.” It was really fun. I didn’t use words; I just did ambient vocal layering over it. The only thing I can draw parallels with is that my music lyrically draws darker undertones and black metal does, too. I think I’m equally affiliated with a pop genre, too.

AP: Who’s record was it that you sang on?

MN: This band called Xasthur. It was a one man black metal band. I’ve done some vocals for some other stuff, too. It’s just kind of fun for me.

AP: Does your work as a painter and teacher ever influence your music?

MN: Yeah. I only have two days left of teaching, ever!

AP: Ever?

MN: Yeah! I’m pretty excited. I won’t be teaching next year because I’ll be touring full time. But yeah, I think my work as a painter and teacher helps with lyrics and how I see the world in terms of being a more visual person. The imagery in my songwriting is kind of painterly and abstract.

AP: Do you base the lyrics off of an image in your head first before you go to write?

MN: Initially songs will come to me as a melody and the lyrics are usually the last thing. I struggle with the lyrics the most in terms of getting them right. So usually there’s some imagery involved in my thought process.

AP: Will you come back and teach again?

MN: I don’t know. I really, really love teaching, but I have to admit I feel like I’m interested in doing soundtracks for films and songwriting for other people and I wouldn’t mind being a professor one day. Who knows what’s going to happen. I’ll be touring and writing new records and getting my fine art into some galleries. This record created some opportunities for touring that I couldn’t say no to or else I’d be looking back in regret. We have plenty of time for settling down but I’m not quite ready for that structure. I’ve been waking up at 5:30am three days a week, and if I have a show I don’t go on until around 11. It’s not the healthiest job in terms of the extremes in sleeping. It has to be one or the other or else I’m always tired at work and at shows.

AP: You’re a pretty big Leonard Cohen fan. How did that start?

MN: It got started in the ‘90s in the grunge era. I was listening to Nirvana, which pretty much everyone was, and “Penny Royalty” had this lyric about Leonard Cohen. This was before the internet. I would sit on my bed and read liner notes and stare at the pictures of musicians. I was like, “Who’s Leonard Cohen?” And at the same time I had a Nina Simone cassette tape that I was playing a lot and she covered “Susanne,” so I finally went to Borders at the mall and bought three Leonard Cohen cassette tapes. I got so into them. It really changed me.

AP: Do you have a favorite album by him?

MN: Yes, Songs For Maroon. I’m a big fan of a lot of songwriters and he’s just one of a cluster that I studied like bibles.

AP: You have a really nice cover of “Famous Blue Raincoat” and it made me wonder how you feel when you decide to cover songs. Is there a lot of pressure? Do you push it off out of fear of misrepresenting them?

MN: Absolutely. There are certain artists I wouldn’t even dare to cover. For instance, I would never cover Roy Orbison because it’s like, why the fuck would you ever cover Roy Orbison? I could never do anything to my voice to come close to or one up Roy Orbison. That’s not the point of the cover, to do better, but I also don’t want to make it worse. I also don’t cover females that often either. I don’t know why; just to avoid being compared to the original? I think the purpose isn’t to make it sound identical, but to make it your own unique take on a song. Usually covering songwriters known for their writing instead of their singing—like Leonard Cohen has a beautiful voice, but he’s mostly known for his songwriting like Bob Dylan—are easier to cover because no one’s going to say, “This doesn’t sound like the original.” They’ll say, “This is an interesting version.” Covering contemporaries is even harder because you have to deal with their fans saying you ruined it.

AP: Yeah, fans and the internet. It’s all wonderful but terrible.

MN: Yeah [laughs]. That’s why I try to stay off it these days.

AP: What’s something you love to hear from fans?

MN: In terms of my own music, I get excited when I play live and people come up to me after and comment on my guitar playing. It’s something I work really hard at and have for a long time. It’s never really talked about in the record reviews. That’s something I’ve been acutely aware of. You can talk about the style and the vibe and the voice… and maybe the musicianship. I don’t know if that’s because I’m a woman and it’s a more subtle style, but that’s it for me.